Sassmouth

TMI Friday, Weekend Edition

Dear Sassmouth Sisters- 
I need your help! There is a strange woman (a neighborhood mom) who has cyber stalked both my husband and now one of my best friends. I get a paranoid but not unjustified feeling that this woman has some sort of obsession with me or my husband. Let me give you some back story. This woman whom I barely know but sent her kids to the same daycare contacted my husband on both linkedin and Facebook. He had never had a conversation with her other than the polite hello you say to parents you pass in the hall and I barely know her either but i had accepted a FB friend request. The messages were about him referring her to a position at his firm and they were long winded (she discussed a lot of what they have in common based on his profile...even though we don't see the similarities.) He felt uncomfortable and politely (but awkwardly!) told her he could not refer someone he didn't know! She then sent him a Facebook request and said in the request message that she was more or less as chatty as me...strange! He declined the invitation and we were both a little freaked out at the weirdness of it all. I then noticed that she had looked through a lot of my old albums on FB and had "liked" pictures of my husband. I have since blocked her from seeing any of my info. A week later when we went to meet my sons teacher before school started, the teacher said to us. " oh I have heard all about your son! He is good friends with ----(her kid)". We have never had a playdate but my kid does know him from preschool although they were never good friends. This woman has an open marriage and both her and her husband (who is even weirder!) have been seen around the neighborhood holding hands with other people. Hey...to each his own but just think its an important detail because it shows that she could have interest with my hubby. She has since sent some strange FB messages to my good friend who she doesn't know at all (but knows she is one of my besties) inviting her kid to her kids b-day party. My friend politely declined and she got a mean message back.

So here's my dilemma. My son is in the same class with her son and my kid is very friendly. He likes almost everyone and makes friends super easy. I love this about him and would never want him to treat another kid badly just because someone is a little strange. (yes her kid is super strange too). BUT I also don't want my kid going over to their house. They are not good friends but her kid keeps inviting my kid over for a playdate and I keep making excuses....I have also overheard the mother telling her kid to chase after us and ask us where we are going. How do I address this with my kid? I don't want him to know that I think this kids parents are too weird to trust my kid at their house...but I also really don't want these people to be involved in our life. I swear I'm not a bitch ( most of the time!) and I hate popularity BS but all my maternal and personal instincts are raising HUGE red flags that something is not right here!!! I'm telling you...if you read the messages you would know this is not a mentally healthy person I'm dealing with! Advice please! Thanks!

Joanna:

Oh my hell, girlfriend. I don't need to read the messages to smell the crazy on this one. And I'm really, really glad you didn't ask how to handle the whole situation because YIKES is that way above my pay grade. Although it might be worth mentioning the situation and your misgivings to the teachers, just so everyone is clear that your two families aren't BFFs and that there is to be no offhand sharing about you guys with Unstable Lady, as often occurs in a close-knit school.

So how to handle with the kid? That's hard, because as you said, you don't want to give him the impression that all weirdos must be shunned (although the likelihood of that happening is probably pretty low). You also don't want to say anything that he might, in innocence, repeat to the other child.

It's possible your son might save you the trouble of figuring out what to do, though -- have you talked to him about this kid, and whether he (your son) is interested in getting together? It might be an opportunity to focus on how we always need to be kind to other people, but not everyone has to be your best friend. If he pressed you on the matter, would your son be receptive to something along the lines of, "I'd rather we spent our time playing with your friends X___ and Z___" ?

And when the kid or his mother asks your son for a playdate, just keep on refusing -- politely, but firmly -- and don't bother with an excuse (which inevitably leads to questions or further invitations). Just, "No, I'm sorry!" and "Thanks for asking, but no, we simply can't." No explanation necessary. Just no, and no, and no. It may not stop the invitations coming, but at least it's polite!

A Married Person Tells You How to Get Divorced

Allow me to preface this by stating that I have never been divorced. But since my own life is lacking in dramatics and that particular flavor of conflict, I have been able to devote a not insignificant amount of time and energy to observing the divorces of others. Some might condemn my interest as prurient, rubbernecking even, but hey, you people are the ones who call me on the phone and the facebook and tell me shit. As an Impartial Observer of All Y'all's Divorces, I would like to offer the following handy tips:

1. Don't even try to be friendly with Ex. Yeah, yeah, it's the nineties and shit and it doesn't have to beeee like that with the animosity but guess what? IT'S GONNA BE. It's gonna be that way for a while, in fact. And the more you try to be reasonable and rational and fifty-fifty and even-handed, the longer you will draw out the unpleasant angry ugly phase. The more opportunities you give your ex to be a douchebag, the more he or she will BE A DOUCHEBAG. And by "opportunity" I mean "slightest chance to disappoint you or your children or not show up as agreed or refuse to do anything not mandated by law or even some things that are."  
   
    
2. Ditto Ex's family, unless there is a significant family divide of the type that results in convoluted letters to advice columnists and everybody is cutting Ex out of their wills and inserting you. These people are, more likely than not, the people who helped make Ex the way he or she is, so not only do they know all the same shitty tricks, they've been practicing a LOT longer.  
   
    
3. Never argue. Never. Ex and probably some of his or her family will be watching your every behavior for the opportunity to start a fight -- did you maybe nod towards a person of the opposite sex? Then you are a whore who takes in gentleman callers in front of your children, who will soon be removed from your care! Did you go out for fries with a friend while your children were left in the care of their loving in-laws? Then...see above. Also you abandoned your children. House getting a little messy? See all of the above and then add in Child Protective Services for living in filth.
   
   They will pounce on any chance to prey upon your insecurities. They want to draw you into an argument because it gives them the opportunity to show off their making-you-miserable chops and because as soon as you're in it, they've won. There is NO winning for you. You cannot win an argument with Ex, no matter how righteous you are -- and the second you start trying, you're at a disadvantage. The only way to get out successfully is to refuse to engage. Delete the text. Delete the email. Hang up the phone. Turn on your heel and walk away.
   
    
4. Cut them off sooner rather than later if their behavior proves troublesome. I don't mean interfere with custody or anything like that; I mean, if ex-Grampa is giving you shit, then he sees his granddaughters on Ex's time and not on yours. If Ex can't be respectful to you, then ex interacts through your lawyer. Does it sound extreme to do that if Ex is just being a whiny little shit like he/she always was the whole time you were together? Maybe. But I'm right. Trust.
   
   
   
5. Prepare to be disappointed at every turn. Alternately, have zero expectations. Need a weekend to care for a dying grandparent? Don't expect any favors from ex -- and by "favors" I mean switching weekends or ceding as little as an hour of child care in order to help you. Did Ex agree to come over to take a kid to the park? Be ready for Ex to show up long enough to throw a coloring book at the child and then have to disappear on "urgent business" (read: booty call). Or just not to show up at all, leaving you to explain to the child.
   
   
   
6. Steel yourself to be hurt on behalf of your children, again and again. Because Ex doesn't feel like paying the child support on time (because you're just going to spend it on whiskey and red shoes!) and they get to eat ketchup sandwiches for dinner again. Because they are so obviously not a priority in Ex's day as evidenced by the string of broken "dates" or shuffled custody plans -- and yet those kids still need and love that parent and believe, every time, that Ex is coming over just like he or she said.
   
   Because Ex is willing to let them down again and again, just to get under your skin. The fact that they have feelings just doesn't even register in Ex's rush to piss you off or hurt you or inconvenience you. And somehow that is even more heartbreaking. 
   
    
7. It's possible that if you follow all those tips, some years down the road, you will have the comfortable, friendly, reasonable, rational divorced relationship you thought you could have. It's been done. But in the majority of cases I have personally dealt with, that peace only comes after years of really heavy boundary-drawing. So why wait? Start demarcating those lines right away. At best you'll end up with something that works down the road; at worst you will have made your reputation as someone who is not to be trifled with -- even if that doesn't change the day-to-day terms of your existence. 
   
   

Did I describe your divorce or breakup? Not on purpose. The examples I used, I only used if I had heard them from more than two people. More than two. I hear the same story again, and again, and again. Who are these shitty people and why are they marrying my friends in the first place? And is there some book they've all read?

Maybe you had a good divorce. Maybe you're one of the lucky few who can jump right to the peaceful phase. That's wonderful and I am genuinely happy for you. But don't assume you will be among them, no matter how willing to compromise you might be. It's so much easier to move the boundary back than it is to push forward belatedly. I'm not suggesting being combative or argumentative -- just be prepared for the other party to be. Just be firm. Be clear about your limits. Prepare for the worst. And for the love of god, remember that the argument is always a quagmire. 

On Having Kids and Not

Question: 

I know at least one of you has experienced postpartum depression. Can you talk about how, if at all, that experience influenced your later decisions about continued spawning? And, if you had known in advance what you would go through, would you have decided to have the kid in the first place?

NOT retrospectively--it was tough but damn was it worth it now that's she's two and a half and fucking precocious--but alternate-reality prospectively. Would you have tried to get pregnant anyway.

And related question/request #2: A friend had PPD after her first child, and decided not to have any more children because she didn't want to go through that experience again. I have zero children. I've been told that I would be at risk for both postpartum depression AND postpartum psychosis if I were to carry a pregnancy to term. (Also, I would have to stop taking a fantastic but, alas, teratogenic medication in order to get pregnant.) I want nothing to do with any of that shit. And I'm certain I'm making the right decision for myself.

While our reasons for not having (any more) children are pretty much the same, she already has one and I don't. She gets all the mommy-hero cred (which I'm not saying is undeserved, let's be clear on that), and I get treated like a second-class citizen because I don't have a young'n to wrangle. She's wonderful about it, and totally understands, but other people in my life do not. What do I say to all those bitch-ass bitches out there who imply (or sometimes come right out and say) that I'm some combination of selfish, not a real grown-up, and less of a woman because I will not be having kids? Please give them the smackdown that I am too polite and mopey to deliver on my own.

Answer:

Joanna: Regarding the first: I had postpartum anxiety and OCD. I would do it again in a second. It wasn't particularly debilitating and resolved spontaneously. (Although, if it were going to happen again, I would definitely eat some placenta and have a support network in place to mitigate the damages.) Bridget's going to have a MUCH better answer.

Regarding the second, well. I'll start at the end. There is NO SMACKDOWN that will make this stop. People always think if they can just say the right thing the assholish behavior will cease and that is just NEVER the case. So give up on that dream. There is nothing you can do about those people because you know? Their shittiness doesn't have anything to do with you. It has to do with their own uncertainty and paranoia and desire to justify and elevate their own choices at the expense of someone else. You can't fix that for someone else so don't bother trying.

It sounds like you have remarkable clarity on what you are doing and why you're doing it. That is GREAT. That is, in fact, the only antidote to any cutting remarks that might come flying your way -- your own unflappable stability in your own decision. You know you're doing the right thing? Then you don't have to justify it to anyone. 

Also, quite frankly, I do NOT understand people with kids who are jerks to kid-friendly people without. Those of us with children so desperately need people without to provide a sympathetic look during a grocery store meltdown, hold a door for a stroller, play with a kid for half an hour while we fix supper, raise our children after our untimely deaths, and generally make the world an accepting place for parents with small children. I can't say enough how much I love the people who like or even just tolerate my kids! Why any parent would want to shoot herself in the foot on that one is beyond me.

Finally: I know what you mean about the mommy-hero credit. It is the flipside to the equally ugly and irritating don't-bring-that-screaming-brat-in-public thing that is so very popular in the media these days. If you let that stuff get under your skin, either way, you're done for. Know you're strong, know you're doing what's best for you, and know that you can't change how other people react to you. If there are actual hurtful comments, the general advice of "Hey, that really bothers me when you say that. Please don't," still holds. And then if they don't stop, limit contact (or gird your loins for Thanksgiving dinner). In the meantime: go out and live a full life, eat good food, do what brings you joy, and know that you are no less a woman or member of the human race for not procreating. And fuck the jerks who tell you otherwise. 

Sisters, feel free to add to the post or respond in the comments -- and everyone else, we would love to have your thoughts and experiences in the comments as well!